The value of Human Players

[SnowBall]

OK. Here's the suggestion. I would like to see some value set for the human player. It should cost some kind of asset for a player to die. I know we all try to be as tactical as possible in this game. I still think the idea of shooting down a pilot and having to go search for him would be a nice addition to this tournament. As it stands right now I understand that a pilot after getting shot down, will go down with the craft in order to just respawn with the airframe. Tankers will just explode with the tank, for the same reason. If we add a value to these players, the aspect of a Combat Search And Rescue mission (CSAR) can become a reality. I believe this would add a great realism factor as well as immersion into the tournament. :cheers2:

[{AToW}Ghost33]

I would love for something like this to be implemented in the future. I can tell you as a pilot I do exactly that. I have never bailed out of my aircraft because as my life means nothing right now it would be more of a hindrance to have people diverted to come pick me back up. I would say have a "life" reserve for the army to simulate what human reserves that the army has, it should be separate of the resource costs for vehicles as it wouldn't make sense to loose lives and in turn that means you cant bring up all those shiny tanks.... although no one would be there to drive them. lol

[[DI]I|Cpl.Dren]

I like the idea, really!

[[IRT]Super64]

If we could figure out the right way to put it into the game that would be awesome. That would create some truly intense firefights because everyone would be doing everything they can not to be killed. Back in the old Ghost Recon ladder days, where one shot killed you and you had no respawns, our matches were extremely tense. Granted we'd still have respawns, it would still put a lot of importance on staying alive.


Also, Dren. Love the sig man! I about fell out of my chair when I saw Simpson Dren! LOL

[Slugs]

I like the idea aswell. what if we put like 200 max respawn per battle on each army? or would it be better to make certain crew positions worth more?

[Strango]

While limited lives may look good on paper, I can state from previous tournament experience in OFP that this idea will help, but it will need a supplement. If you just limit lives alone what happens most of the time is people play like normal until someone realizes the team is starting to run low on lives and then they go into caution mode.

Since both teams are limited on lives it really turns the game more into a team death match of who can get the best kill to death ratio because essentially after one team loses all of their lives the battle for that day will be over.

My suggestion as a supplement would be to lengthen the respawn times and make it more difficult to get right back in the action. If it takes a guy 5+ minutes to get back into the action again after he dies then he's going to be more careful with his life.

[[IRT]Super64]

Strango, i dont think we're talking about a limited amount of lives really. But more of a way to factor in the price of dying into the end result of the day. Having a team lose 100 soldiers compared to another team losing 80 might end up in a resource penalty the next week. Just having a value to each soldier lost can change things up, i believe.

[Strango]

Originally posted by Super 64+Sun, 9 Sep 2007 - 18:50--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Super 64 &#064; Sun, 9 Sep 2007 - 18:50)</div><div class='quotemain'>Strango, i dont think we&#39;re talking about a limited amount of lives really.

51745
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<!--QuoteBegin-Slugs@Sun, 9 Sep 2007 - 14:57
what if we put like 200 max respawn per battle on each army?

51732
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If it&#39;s as simple as comparing the number of deaths at the end of the day and seeing who had more and giving them a resource penalty I think that would work, but you wouldn&#39;t get that intense feeling that you were referring to earlier. I know my suggestion is extreme and for a limited audience. I can already guess Steveak&#39;s response, lol.

It most likely doesn&#39;t have a place here, but I thought I&#39;d suggest it anyway since someone started a post on making player&#39;s lives more valuable.

EDIT: If you want to do this through scoring then you need to have death penalties add up to the value of holding multiple objectives. Unless you weight it that heavy it won&#39;t have an impact on game play because it&#39;s still in your best interest to sacrifice yourself for the good of the objective.

[Wolf]

I like the idea, pilots should be expensive, as they cost a lot to train.

This is a true story: The British Army bought a bunch of the new Apache Gunships.
They cost so much to buy, that they then found that they didn&#39;t have the money to train any pilots to fly them&#33;&#33; http://au.gamespot.com/news/6163836.html

Also an officer should cost more to respawn than a grunt.

What about a limited number of respawns for pilots, when they exceed that, they have to go play grunt&#33; :)

[[DI]I|Cpl.Dren]

I would prefer more of 5min visit at island (we need some annoying sound track to there) after death.
resources doesent infect players as much as of hanging useless at some island.

[SnowBall]

Originally posted by Dren@Mon, 10 Sep 2007 - 8:29
I would prefer more of 5min visit at island (we need some annoying sound track to there) after death.
resources doesn&#39;t effect players as much as of hanging useless at some island.

51779


My main concern in not so much the basic grunt sitting out as it is the pilots or tankers. The reason I would like to implement this idea, is because, pilots would rather just die and respawn when they get shot down and tankers wouldn&#39;t leave their vehicles when death was immanent. I know respawns are a way of life when you play FPS online games. I just think there should be some kind of regulation. The resource will effect the player in the long run. A lot of people are in this stuff for the short gain. If they want to just play all stupid, let &#39;em. When it comes time to buy the next tank or airframe, and they can&#39;t afford it because, too many squads are being careless. I guess thats the "price" they pay. I do still think you should sit and wait after being killed. I&#39;m just not that sure it should be on some remote island somewhere. While a sound track is plenty annoying, I don&#39;t like it. I think that the punishment far exceeds the crime. In FPS games, people will get tagged. They will respawn. I just want people to have an incentive not to have to respawn, beyond the obvious, of course.

[Wolf]

Maybe you respawn into a lift (elevator to the Americans) and as you &#39;travel&#39; back to earth (going up or down, depending if you have been a good boy or not) you get to listen to bland annoying muzak, if that don&#39;t make you fighting mad and desperate not to get killed again, nothing will.

[[IRT]Super64]

@Wolf - hilarious man&#33; lol I could imagine having to sit 5 minutes on a remote island having to listen to the Aqua song "Im a Barbie Girl... In a Barbie world....". That would be some punishment. :2ROFL:


I believe there should be more value put on not only tankers and pilots but grunts. But not as much as the armor and air guys. Just enough to make the thought of having to respawn painful and knowing that when you die it will benefit the other teams efforts for the day.

The only thing I can think of off hand would be some type of resource gain for enemy soldiers killed at the end of the day. We don&#39;t want to extend respawn waits too long for grunts because that would slow the ground battle to a total crawl.

@Strango - I agree having limited respawns for all would create an intense combat feeling. Perhaps having some type of scrimmage game set up where everyone can experience the intensity of a limited or no respawn large scale battle could give us a better feel for it. Battles would (or could) be shorter. At least until everyone adapted to how to fight such an encounter. But oh man the tension in game is very cool.


More study is needed.

[Steveak44]

:dance: What is really disturbing is Super knows Barbie Girl is by Aqua. :dance: :yuck:

Somebody check his Mancard. :D

[[IRT]Super64]

Originally posted by Steveak44@Tue, 11 Sep 2007 - 11:39
:dance: What is really disturbing is Super knows Barbie Girl is by Aqua. :dance: :yuck:

Somebody check his Mancard. :D

51892



LOL I was waiting for someone to say that. My gf listens to that song in the car every time we take a road trip. After the 6th time I feel like :2bash:

[SnowBall]

Wow&#33; You made to the sixth time? After about the first five seconds I&#39;d be :shoot:

[{UN}Coolio (Retired)]

I dont think that man points in general is a good way to motivate ppl if any of you feel that there is a need, tho the SAR missions sounds sexy.

I dont think that this tounament will attract that many run and gun ppl, so it will be the less skilled cannonfodder that will pay for this. What are we supposed to do with players who die "to much". Kick them of the team because the lack of skill is costing the army to many resorces?&#33;. If some one is constantly dieing the team is allready receiving a penelty as it makes it harder to defende or capture.

If it becomes a problem and negative motivation is the only option I would like to see respawn time increased. Personal I dont see that beeing necessary now.

[SnowBall]

Originally posted by CooliO@Tue, 11 Sep 2007 - 18:26
...What are we supposed to do with players who die "to much". Kick them of the team because the lack of skill is costing the army to many resorces?&#33;. If some one is constantly dieing the team is allready receiving a penelty as it makes it harder to defende or capture.

If it becomes a problem and negative motivation is the only option I would like to see respawn time increased. Personal I dont see that beeing necessary now.

51924


If you have a player that dies too much then that player should train more with the unit and learn the best way to approach a situation before engaging in a fire fight. Obviously they are doing something wrong. Training is designed to teach you what to do and how. Done right, there would be minimal casualties on your side.